[Catalyst] Re: Catalyst vs Rails vs Django Cook off

[Jay K]

I agree 100% on this... if we are judging Catalyst, et al, as simple  
dispatchers, then we should consider apache+cgi in the discussion as  
well - as apache is obviously one of the most venerable and widely  
deployed dispatchers out there.

A framework is much more than that.  In my experience, the costs in  
time and money involved in building and maintaining the code for an  
app outweigh the cost of deploying it by huge margins.  Furthermore,  
by the time you are experiencing enough traffic to be analyzing the  
performance at this granular a level, there are much better ways to  
improve your responses per second that cost much less in terms of  
time and money.

These days, for less than the cost of a week of work, you can double  
your serving capacity easily - and because of the 'fringe benefits'  
of using Catalyst this is usually simply a matter of swapping out  
session and caching plugins (if you even use them) to the more cross- 
server compatible modules.

If you are using a frontend cache like squid, you can do even more  
cost-for-performance-wise.

Personally, I use Catalyst because it takes care of a lot of details  
I would rather not worry about.  When I  am free of worrying about  
all those details, I can focus on building JUST my application  
logic.  This means that my application logic tends to be more solid,  
because I am not tracking a ton of specifics outside of my app.

Because I'm not constantly crossing the line between my app and base  
functionality (responding to HTTP, getting the correct bit of code  
executed based on the request, etc.), I am not chasing bugs related  
to that line.  I can rely on the fact that it will always happen in a  
particular way and if I have a bug, it's more than likely in my  
application, so I can focus there.

That is the power of a Framework any 'benchmark' that doesn't take  
those things into account is so much fluff and of no use to me.

JayK

On Jan 17, 2007, at 9:44 AM, Marcello Romani wrote:

> David Morel ha scritto:
>> Le 15 janv. 07 à 21:51, Christopher Hicks a écrit :
>>> On Mon, Jan 15, 2007 at 08:27:08PM +0100, Daniel McBrearty wrote:
>>>> I don't see any reason why it shouldn't be meaningful if it was  
>>>> done
>>>> well. Not that anyone should choose their framework on the basis of
>>>> such a benchmark, but it's a factor to throw into the mix
>> Does that include dynamic content caching wizardry ? It is  
>> meaningless if you don't take into account real-life scenarios  
>> like reverse proxy cache invalidation policies (and tricks). This  
>> is just to say that all this perf talk is meaningless : sometimes  
>> the power you get from a well thought out framework allows you to  
>> do things that are close to magick, speed-wise among others.  
>> Comparing simple setups is ridiculous IMHO.
>> David Morel
>
> If a framework makes development easier because it's more elegant,  
> easy to use, or whatever, then you may have more time to think  
> about setting up a more efficient deployment architecture (i.e. the  
> thinks mentioned above).
> Therefore it seems to me that ease of developement might be more  
> important to the overall app performance than the raw speed in  
> simple test cases.
>
> Just my 2 (euro)cents.
>
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>
> -- 
> Marcello Romani
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